How to Fix your Bodyclock with Royan Kamyar, MD, CEO of OWaves

[00:00:01] I want to talk to my fellow nurses for a moment because this is important. I just finished reading Speak Up Start Now by Rosa Hart, RN, SCRN. And I'm telling you, for once someone said out loud what so many of us feel every day in healthcare. That we're waiting to feel ready, to feel confident enough to believe that our voices matter. This book shuts all of that down in the best possible way.

[00:00:26] Rosa doesn't just write from theory. She writes from lived experience at the bedside, in leadership, and in rooms where real decisions are made. And she reminds us, page after page, that imposter syndrome doesn't get the final say. We do. Speak Up Start Now gives you the tools to step into your voice with the confidence healthcare desperately needs from us.

[00:00:50] I'm recommending this book to every nurse, every new grad, every leader, and every person who's ever felt like their ideas weren't enough. Because the truth is, healthcare can't wait. And neither can we. The change we want to see starts with our voice. Your voice. Do yourself a favor. Get this book. Read it. And then go speak up. And start now. Speak Up Start Now by Rosa Hart, RN, SCRN. Available now.

[00:01:32] Hello, and welcome to the Nurse Rosa's INsights. I'm your host, Rosa Hart. And today I'm joined by Royan Kamyar from faraway San Diego, California. Thank you so much for being with me across the country today. Of course. Thanks for having me. So we met a couple of times, I think. Didn't we meet first in Vegas and then at AI Med? No, I didn't make the Vegas conference. Which one was that? Not by...

[00:02:00] Were we messaging about meeting at the health conference and then it didn't work out? Is that what happened? Right. And we met at AI Med in San Diego. Yes. Where you won an award, I believe, in the Shark Tank, right? Yeah, we came in third place on the Pitch Contest. Yeah. Well, it's Olympic season, right? So everybody's into these medals. I'll be good bronze. Yeah, we were happy about that. You got the bronze award. Do you have it with you? I do, actually. It's back here.

[00:02:28] Oh, show me. Because I wasn't in that part of the session. So I'd love to see it. There it is. I was wondering if it was made of bronze. No, it's maybe plastic. You'll accept third place on the Shark Tank. That's what's up. I love that. Yeah, you got to keep that where people can see it. That's pretty exciting. I know. Yeah, I'll keep it up. So tell us about what you made your, what you got your award for, O-Waves. What is it?

[00:02:52] Sure. Yeah, it's a startup. It's a company that we've been working on. And essentially, it digitizes lifestyle medicine. It became a huge Dean Ornish acolyte over the years. And also brings to life circadian biology. So it's a digital platform. It's a calendar. But it's really meant to help people optimize their circadian rhythm around these key lifestyle medicine behaviors like exercise, sleep, nutrition.

[00:03:17] And we're mostly focused on college students. We have over a million downloads, and that's where we see the most traction. And we're really kind of capturing this lifestyle psychiatry movement and focusing our indications on mental health. So our first prospect of RCT with UC San Diego is focused on mental health outcomes for college students. Yeah, that's so exciting. And so you are a physician. You went to med school, and then you went back to get your MBA.

[00:03:46] At Rady, is that right? At UC San Diego. Yeah. At UC San Diego. And then, so that really, how did you come to kind of pivot into business from medicine? I come from a family of physicians. So medicine was sort of always in the cards. Older sister, both parents, you know, uncles, aunts, cousins, now wife, and brother-in-law, and, you know, and so on.

[00:04:07] But I always wanted to start a company. So it was kind of always the idea to combine, you know, an MD and MBA in terms of the sort of series or format in terms of how that came to fruition. You know, originally, I was looking at combined MD and MBA programs, eventually decided to finish medical school, do my intern year, get my license, and then jump into an MBA program.

[00:04:32] And UC San Diego was kind of brand new campus, because they didn't have a business major. When I left San Diego, I'm from here. But when I found out, they kind of developed this business school, which was really positioned at the intersection of entrepreneurship and life sciences. I took the chance and jumped all in, and I've been here ever since. Yeah. You said you always knew you wanted to start a company. Were you pretty entrepreneurial when you were growing up?

[00:05:00] I mean, yes and no. Like, my parents are pretty conservative. And so, you know, in our culture, like, salesmanship wasn't necessarily an aspirational trait. Like, it was not polite to try to sell things to your cousins or your uncles or aunts, right? So, that was a little bit, you know, not encouraged. You know, but I loved the idea of having your own lemonade stand and, you know, always wanted to invest in stock.

[00:05:27] So, I just love business. But, you know, again, I came from a family physician. So, it was really, you know, med school or, you know, or bust. You're going to be part of this family. You have to go to business. Yeah, that's the ticket. You have to, you know, pay the price. But, you know, I had a really good mentor at UC Berkeley who kind of, like, helped me think about, originally biotech.

[00:05:54] So, I was thinking of, like, you know, drug discovery, stem cells, genetics. But it wasn't until my medical intern year when I realized how much we ignored prevention as a field. And the irony of wearing a white coat and telling people, you know, patients to take good care of themselves. It was just so thick. You know, especially, I did my intern year in downtown Manhattan. And we had, you know, easily the worst lifestyles. You know, and we were basically trying to, you know, teach patients how to lower their blood pressure and their cholesterol, etc.

[00:06:23] So, I became really passionate about lifestyle as medicine. And really, I was applying it to myself first. When I started my MBA program, I was pulling out my trusty notebook and just kind of drawing out my day. And I started thinking about, okay, I only have 24 hours every day. But I know it's 24 hours. I need to allocate seven to nine to sleep. And I want to plan out my meals. I want to exercise for at least an hour.

[00:06:48] And so, you know, to me, it became almost like an interesting formula that I had to fill. And the insight that we always only get 24 hours, like that rubric doesn't change. Those constraints are pretty consistent. And so, we can kind of come up with this optimal formula. And that's kind of personalized and suits our needs. And then, you know, actually at UC San Diego, they have one of the first and still only dedicated centers for circadian biology.

[00:07:13] And then, that's when I realized how deep this kind of science and art of when you do things can go. And I became really passionate about it. And yeah. So, it's kind of brought me full circle until today. Yeah. So, calendar tracking has been used in a lot of different ways. Do you integrate with like the wearables that track your sleep and things like that? Absolutely. So, I use an Aura right now.

[00:07:39] And actually, Dr. Ricky Bloomfield is a pediatrician and chief medical officer at Aura just joined our clinical advisory team. Really? So, we're working closely with wearables. You know, I'm also using an Apple Watch, for example. Oh, fun. I was going to ask. I have a whoop band. Would that sync up with it? Anything that integrates with Apple Health, we pick up. Oh, okay. And put into our algorithm. So, yeah. Apple Health really democratizes a lot of the wearable activity tracking. Fantastic. Okay. Yeah.

[00:08:09] So, then, for example, because like I'm using whoop right now and it has a whole lot of things you can track in there. So, what would that integration look like? And what added insights could I get from the O-Waves app as well? Right. I think this is where it kind of gets into sort of our philosophy on positive lifestyle change, right? Which is not the same experience you would get from an activity tracker.

[00:08:34] Most, you know, activity trackers, if you think about it, you pull out your app and you look at your dashboard. You're almost always looking backwards in time, right? You're kind of retrospectively analyzing your sleep, your stress score, whatever the case may be. But at its root, you're kind of looking backwards to see what your activity tracker is telling you the first half of your day or last night or yesterday. Okay.

[00:09:01] You know, it felt like I got hit by a truck during my medical intern year in Manhattan. And so, I came out of it saying, okay, I need to take better care of myself and how am I going to do this? It's a very prospective oriented experience, right? Like you're always planning, you're always looking forward. You're doing the grocery shopping to make the right recipes to get your right meal planned in place. You're packing your gym bag the night before, doing your laundry so that you have something.

[00:09:29] You put it in the back of your car so you can get to the gym at 3 p.m. later that day. It's very planning oriented, forward looking experience. And so, at root, we believe that the primary interface for positive lifestyle change is actually a planner or calendar. If you look at Dean Ornish's recipe for lifestyle medicine, right, which the American College of Lifestyle Medicine has adopted, nutrition, sleep, exercise, stress management, relationships, the common denominator is time, hours and minutes. So, they're actually prescribed units of time.

[00:09:58] And so, conveniently, the calendar or day planner becomes, again, in my opinion, in our opinion, the optimal tool for positive lifestyle change. So, that's where you plan everything. That's where you're looking forward. That's your dashboard. And then, the wearable activity tracking data, in my opinion, comes in secondarily to layer on top of that. So, you can actually compare. Here's what I intended to do. This is what I wanted to do today. This is what actually happened. Yeah.

[00:10:23] And then, that delta is, I think, the root of the conversation you need to have with a clinician or the state and age AI, right? Or some combination of the or two to say, how do we bridge that gap? Yeah. And tell it to give you very honest feedback. Well, I mean, sometimes we're not honest with ourselves, right? If we think about it. Exactly. Like, if you go through the process of, like, if, you know, I asked you, you know, Rosa, what's your ideal day, right? Or what do you hope to accomplish, you know, the rest of the day or tomorrow?

[00:10:51] You might be overly ambitious or kind of, like, you know, think that you can accomplish, you know, all these, you know, lists of goals that you might have in your phone and collect over time in the next 24 hours, right? And so then we have to be honest with ourselves. Like, you know, even something as simple as, like, okay, I want to go to the gym. And then you block off one hour and you realize, oh, geez, it actually takes me 15 or 20 minutes just to get my, you know, gym socks and T-shirt into a bag.

[00:11:17] And then it takes another 20, 30 minutes to get to the gym and, like, actually get behind some equipment. And now I have the hour to work out. And then there's another 45 minutes. So all of a sudden, you know, two or three hours of your day is gone, right? Yeah, it's a bigger commitment than just that. So I think, you know, you're right. It's about being honest with, like, what we can actually accomplish over 24 hours.

[00:11:38] And I think that dialectic, you know, where we're kind of always in this mode of self-improvement and we're trying to increment to this optimal version of ourselves, it gives us something objective to think about. And then kind of coming back to your original question, like, how does this compare with other platforms or kind of state-of-the-art in terms of the clinic, right?

[00:11:55] I believe hours and minutes is a much more palatable metric for an average patient than millimeters of mercury, millimoles per deciliter, or, you know, you name it, steps, calories, grams. And it's like the list goes on. In terms of number of metrics, we would expect the patient to monitor for primary care. If we can reduce that and boil it down to hours and minutes, I think we do a lot of people a good favor just to say, like, this is what you need to accomplish over the next 24 hours.

[00:12:22] Like when you recommend that they get 30 minutes of exercise at five days a week? I mean, you know, again, this is like a philosophical, I would say, difference between, you know, how we approach things, which is like, okay, like, sure, you can keep reminding people that their blood pressure is above normal, which, you know, they may already know, right? And so now you're in the business of telling them every day, okay, it's above normal.

[00:12:45] And then unless they're on medication, maybe you're serving the purpose of flagging them and they need medication or they need to go up on their dose. But let's say in the maintenance stage of that, if they're already taking their medication, I don't know how much additional value that creates besides actually going to what the intervention is itself, right? What you're really trying to tell them is to take better care of their blood pressure.

[00:13:11] And then the best ways to do that include these behaviors such as eating XYZ, exercising, getting the right amount of sleep, managing stress, right? So, like, so how much of that daily interface needs to be reminding them of their current millimeters of mercury, right? Versus actually helping them accomplish these behaviors that underlie, you know, arguably a root cause for that metric, right? For the high blood pressure.

[00:13:39] But would you say that Gen Z is really, like, primed to take advantage of something like this? I know you said you're focused on your randomized control trials being on college students. That's still Gen Z, right? We didn't get to Gen Alpha in college. Technically, you're probably still right. Oh, good. Man, we're getting old fast. At least that's what my kids tell me. I hear you.

[00:14:06] I've got one who's Gen Z and one who's Gen Alpha, but I can't remember what it is. Anyway, I was just thinking, you know, Gen Z is prioritizing their health so much. It's making huge waves in lots of different industries, like alcohol industry, for example. Yeah. In another part of my life, I do a lot of food and beverage podcasting.

[00:14:30] And we've talked quite a bit about how much the alcohol industry has been impacted and seen a loss of profits due to Gen Zs not drinking alcohol. Like, they want their health to be better. Maybe they're taking certain green leaves instead. But it is from all of that evidence of the harms of alcohol, right?

[00:14:57] And so if they're going to be shifting entire culture waves with the shift from cocktails to mocktails, which we are now seeing in all these different restaurants, then you can see that establishing healthy habits in their everyday life is incredibly important to them. So is that part of why you started studying it in them? Or was it more about availability of that's who was around you?

[00:15:25] That's where we just got the loudest and clearest signal, because we've been out on the App Store for a few years now. And that's where the adoption was the deepest. And, you know, they kind of self-reported diagnoses or issues with attention. So ADHD, autism, depression, anxiety. And actually, kind of the core use case, at least to date, has been around a concept called time blindness.

[00:15:49] So having visual structure over your 24-hour day and something to actually guide you and kind of present as a roadmap for a healthy lifestyle, they find very valuable. So we gravitated to, you know, Gen Z, Gen Alpha, because that's where we see the traction the most.

[00:16:08] And then, you know, the key value proposition is really around having visual structure and being able to better manage time, essentially. Visual aids are very key to adopting new concepts, aren't they? So that makes sense as well. Well, I think it's time for me to ask you the billion dollar question. Are you ready for this? I think so. Okay.

[00:16:33] So, Royan, if you were given a grant for $1 billion to meet a need that you see in health care, how would you like to see it used strategically to have the most sustainable impact? You know, I think there's something really opportune around teaching lifestyle medicine to college students. It's the first time they leave the mother's nest, right? And they're essentially designing their lifestyle for the first time, you know, typically in a new city.

[00:17:03] And so if they're oriented when they come in through, you know, those to a new campus and the campus is immediately teaching them the importance of these principles around seven to nine hours of sleep, importance of meal planning and nutrition, the value of exercise.

[00:17:21] In terms of all the outcomes they eventually care about, whether it's getting the best job when they graduate, whether it's creating, you know, the greatest relationships and achieving the highest GPA or becoming the best version of themselves. Right. We know these lifestyle principles are so core to that experience and those positive outcomes. But I don't think this is getting taught.

[00:17:42] And so we know, for example, the happiness course at Yale became this oversubscribed, like, you know, most popular class on the campus's history and, you know, similar phenomenon at UCC Diego. Now with their student wellness course, the students are creating this information, but there's nothing really, you know, kind of nationwide widespread to really get the word out on the importance of self-care and lifestyle medicine.

[00:18:06] And I think we know, you know, as healthcare workers that changing behavior much later in life gets increasingly difficult, right? Because we kind of become embedded in these daily routines that may not be serving us well. So I think capturing students as they arrive to a new location and they're setting up shop and designing their own lifestyles for the next four years, teaching them the principles of lifestyle medicine.

[00:18:32] So wellness course and then leveraging all these devices and the latest and greatest technology and AI to help them measure and monitor their behaviors and actually gain insights and improve. And essentially, it would be like a, you know, one credit pass no pass course nationwide.

[00:18:51] We would kind of do whatever funding is necessary to run the clinical trials and prove how efficacious it is and monitor over the course of four plus years to study, you know, graduation rates and the whole nine yards. But really, you know, empowering them almost as a citizen scientists and their body becomes like an N equals one experience during the four years and they learn which behaviors get them to their personal health, wellness, productivity goals.

[00:19:16] And they can learn firsthand how things like alcohol, you know, immediately disrupts your REM sleep and then ruins, you know, the next day. And they can measure and monitor and learn that themselves with data and with, you know, education and curriculum to sort of support that. So that's interesting that you say that there's not really this information being taught. I mean, there's people are watching YouTube videos about stuff like this all the time.

[00:19:43] But do you mean like there's a lack of a standardized authoritative source that's all in one place? Yeah, I think I was hesitating to use those types of words like standardized and authoritative because, I mean, I feel like, you know, part of it is sort of discovering for yourself what sort of optimal lifestyle looks like. But in a sense, you're right.

[00:20:05] Like, I think, first of all, like, you know, getting information through YouTube versus like through a university professor, we know is even now still has a meaningful, you know, difference in terms of how that information gets digested. And to the degree with which you believe and immerse yourself in that type of content.

[00:20:25] I think the university setting still has an upper hand in terms of like, you know, whether it's considered the truth or really ultimately impacting your behavior because you're surrounded by, you know, colleagues and peers in a physical setting where you're paying high tuition rates to absorb this information. So I feel like, you know, you're physically there on that campus to be taking these classes.

[00:20:51] So I think that the gravity of that course would be much more significant if it was, in a sense, yes, mandated by the school. Like, this is something that you do during orientation or that first year where you really taught them. Like, let's face it, like, over one out of every two college students, by the time they graduate, they will suffer from a mental health issue. Right? Like, that's statistically, like, you look left, you look right. By the time you graduate, one of you will be, will unfortunately suffer from a mental health issue.

[00:21:18] And, you know, lifestyle psychiatry is kind of pushing the thesis that I think a lot of us believe that you can actually get in front of a lot of these psychiatric issues with positive self-care. You know, sleep alone can be considered, you know, a pretty powerful intervention for getting in front of a lot of, you know, stress and anxiety.

[00:21:38] And so, you know, if you really embody not just sleep, but the whole lifestyle medicine formula, whether it's relationships, stress management, exercise, proper nutrition, I think you'll see it, you know, obviously somewhat biased belief, but a huge decrease in the number of mental health issues that you see on campus. The students really understood the power of these lifestyle interventions, and then tying that into circadian biology, right, which is like this whole, you know, chronotherapy has decades of research behind it.

[00:22:08] And so that, that to me is like, that combination of lifestyle medicine, circadian biology is really synergistic. And then, you know, if you can get, again, a whole class rallied around this, and all of a sudden there's like a peer support element to it, and the university is encouraging it, I think all of a sudden it becomes like an environmental, almost like blue zone phenomenon, right? So I think there's a lot that can be done with the one unit pass, not pass student wellness course.

[00:22:36] And we do absorb information so much better when it's in person than when it's virtual. I mean, I listen to YouTube videos all the time. Right, yeah. And I might absorb some of them better than others, but it's so different than when, like you said, you're in a room physically with other people. And I think, I don't know if the classes you were talking about being oversubscribed, like the Yale Happiness class or the equivalent at UC San Diego, were in person or virtual.

[00:23:04] It's a lot easier to oversubscribe if it's just virtual and everybody can tune in. But I love how you were talking about that key component of building those habits together. Because at first when you're talking about it conceptually, you could insert that as like one session of everybody's, let's see, when I got my first bachelor's degree, it was APSU 1000 is what it was called at Austin Peay. Right.

[00:23:32] And it's just your basic one-on-one entry to college. This is how you do college life. This is what's expected of you and all that stuff. And we met like once a week for an hour and it was a one credit hour, but it was required. And so I think every college has that. So my first thought was, well, why not just do it, incorporate it into that that already exists? Because it wouldn't necessarily have to stand alone.

[00:24:00] It's not like they're such high-level concepts, but that would already give you that format of we're going to be in the same room with these people creating the expectations. You know, one of our advisors taught a course at UW where they essentially brought their own devices, their wearable devices to the course. He's the data science professor. And basically they would, you know, it was kind of like quantified self.

[00:24:25] I'm not sure if you're familiar with that movement, but, you know, they would be measuring their own, you know, vital signs or, you know, whatever you can track with these devices. And they would bring that into class and they would, you know, do problem sets or, you know, analyze their own data as part of the homework for the course. So it was essentially an entire course around analyzing your own wearables data, essentially. You know what? Honestly, I need that. Everyone needs it, right?

[00:24:51] Like to really fully appreciate the heart rate variability and what does that even mean? There you go. It's a whole course. Like you wouldn't be able to do that in a day. It's not like part of another course. And again, I think that already is kind of the root problem is we're not giving this the amount of attention and merit it deserves. Like this is like, you know, the odds of becoming obese or overweight are just, you know, two to one, right?

[00:25:18] Like your chances of becoming overweight or obese are greater than the chances that you have a normal BMI throughout life, right? We know that pre-diabetic or diabetic. Like the odds are that you, you know, gravitate in that direction, unfortunately, as on the standard American diet. And so and then we come back to all these mental health issues that we're seeing on campus today. So why not get in front of that?

[00:25:44] And, you know, I kind of, you know, I kind of, again, you know, in terms of like how much it becomes standardized or mandated, I feel like that's where, you know, it feels like a little bit tricky because, you know, we have all these, I guess, I don't know how to put it. But like there's like something that feels a little bit off about just like mandating it, but I think at least offering it. Right. And I think if it's positioned appropriately, like who wouldn't want to take that class?

[00:26:13] Right. You know, you just imagine that the default pathway is one of poor mental health and poor metabolic health. And there's a course that, again, we would use that billion dollars to prove out these endpoints.

[00:26:26] And if we could definitively say taking this course, learning lifestyle medicine, applying circadian biology, that you can actually improve your GPA, lower mental health issues, lower metabolic health issues in a demonstrable way, which I believe would be the case. You know, again, if organized correctly, I feel like everyone would want to take that class. So maybe we don't have to mandate it, but we just prove out the endpoint.

[00:26:52] So that is so compelling and powerful that any student would want to jump in, essentially. And position the marketing to make them want it. Because if you do that right, they're going to want it no matter what the actual endpoints are. I mean, that's important because, you know, it's just like health care. Like in the university life, there's multiple stakeholders besides the patient or in this case, the student. There's the parent, there's student affairs, right?

[00:27:17] There's potentially a student health insurance plan could or may not be involved. So anyways, I mean, you know, you can imagine the parent might care more about like mitigating mental health issues. But the student as like an invincible 18 year old may not want to invest, you know, an hour a week and that sort of outcome. But that's where the productivity marketing, right? The GPA promises.

[00:27:44] Actually, the same advisor I alluded to before, Ben Smarr, he's now faculty at UC San Diego. He ran a study that showed aligning your course schedule with your chronotype can make a 0.4 GPA difference. So it's half a letter grade. And I know every pre-med student, if they knew that, would totally select their courses accordingly. And so, you know, and that would be the marketing to students, obviously, is, you know, performance and relationships. I think, you know, it can have a huge upside there as well.

[00:28:14] For sure. And maybe help with some communication issues. You know, look how little sleep I got. I just don't have the energy for this right now. And love is part of Ornish's formula, right? Like that's like now standardized as part of the lifestyle medicine, you know, core pillars, right? Like you have to value and put hours and minutes into relationships. And, you know, people can easily forget that.

[00:28:38] And now tying it into health outcomes and, you know, just imagine the mental health benefits from valuing and prioritizing relationships. And then, you know, and then teaching in a course like this, like why it still matters to be face-to-face with people, right? Like why eye contact is important. Like sadly, we might have to learn that, you know, in a textbook or course.

[00:28:59] But we know now that we already went through the effort of sort of standardizing it as a lifestyle vital sign because it needed that to get people's attention. And so now we have to teach it to students as well that this is like a core pillar of a long, healthy life, essentially. Well, and when you were talking about it being measured in minutes and things like that and investing that time in our relationships, if you're planning things out, just like you're packing your gym bag.

[00:29:27] I remember I heard Jordan Peterson talking about marriage one time and how if you're going to have a date night, you need to plan for having 90 minutes with your spouse to catch up beforehand to work through all the logistics of your life. And like all of the stuff you've been waiting to talk about with the kids and house and bills and all that.

[00:29:52] And he's like, do not be acting like you're going to have a date, a romantic date night until you already had your 90 minutes of like life management session. So you could work that into your O-Waves app of here's our 90 minutes of life management before we go on our date night, you know? A hundred percent. I mean, I think there's value in that, right?

[00:30:17] Because like we kind of talk about like our values, like, OK, I care most about my family and then maybe second or third down on the list is work. But then when we look at how our buckets of time are getting spent, like inevitably a lot of us in health care, like that work category just outweighs by an order of magnitude, whatever is going on underneath, whether it's family or anything else. And so that's part of what we help people visualize is like you may say that your family is the most important thing going on in your life.

[00:30:46] But then when you look at your schedule, you can see how much you're actually prioritizing your relationships. Yeah, exactly. Well, I think that is really awesome because I really needed to think that through. And I love how you positioned it as far as the O-Waves is how you're looking out forward and you're proactively planning. And then you can use devices like your wearables to look back at what actually happened. And if it's measuring up to your goal so that you can work towards that. I love the synchronicity there.

[00:31:17] I think it's about bridging that delta between what you're planning to do and what you've actually done. And then I think there's a lot, as you know, in terms of goal attainment, how to structure reasonable goals. And I think probably a lot of us are pretty poor at it, frankly, speaking for myself first. And then just realizing how deep the science around goal attainment is. So I think even in getting help setting those goals, right?

[00:31:46] I think that's also like a core function of a good coach or clinician or in this day and age AI. You know, you say you want to run a marathon in the spring. But like, how does that really jibe with everything else going on in your life? Like, is that is that you trying to run away from something? Or is that actually a meaningful goal that we should start structuring your days to achieve? So, yeah, I think in summary, you got it.

[00:32:10] But with the asterisk around, like, when we try to help you reach your goals, I think part of it is making sure those are the right goals for you. Yeah, exactly. Well, that is so awesome. I really appreciate you sharing that with us today. And if someone is interested, how can they find O-Waves on their phone? O-Waves.com is spelled O like Ocean, W-A-V-E-S. And we're in the app store. It's called My Body Clock is the app title.

[00:32:37] So if you start Googling Body Clock or Body Clock.ai, you'll find us. But O-Waves is the easiest way. Yeah, it's pretty unique. I like that. And if someone wants to talk to you more about it or partner with you in some way, is LinkedIn the best way to get in contact with you? Yeah, by all means. And my first name at O-Waves.com. So Royan at O-Waves. Awesome. And I will have your LinkedIn in the show notes.

[00:33:03] So for those of you who are listening, if you enjoyed this episode of Nurse Rosa's Insights, be sure you like and follow. Leave me a comment. Let me know if you know someone else with a billion-dollar idea that can transform the face of what health looks like in America. And make sure you check out my website, NurseRosaSpeaks.com, if you would like to have me come speak. And I have a book out now. It's called Speak Up, Start Now.

[00:33:31] My goal is to make that the Nurses Week Gift of the Year and replace those rocks that say rock. So if you would like to check that out, it's available on Amazon. Or you can just find it at NurseRosaSpeaks.shop, which is different from the .com. And I'll have all my links in the show notes as well. Royan, thank you so much again for joining me today. Thanks for having me. It was fun. And I hope you have some good rest tonight and keep up with your circadian rhythm.

[00:34:01] Thank you. You too. Okay. And I'll see you all in the next episode.